Harding Park 1st look - all new 2Ds...uploaded

[badgolfer1]

I just played my first round and, even more than the course (which was great) I appreciated the "package" that came with it. In real life this course was, in effect "resurrected from the dead" in 2003. Thanks to Eric for another great "Real" course.
I noticed some different textures for rough and greens-did you do them yourself? (I'm too tired to go back through the posts).
I understand that the President's Cup will be there in 2026-the only thing missing are spectators and tournament objects...

COULD THERE HAVE BEEN POSSIBLY A CHANGE IN PLANS? ALSO MEDINAH DONE
HERE IN LINKS BACK IN 2005 BY JOHN PINEDA HAS HAD A COUPLE OF HOLE CHANGES. #15 HAS HAD POND ADDED TO RIGHT SIDE OF FAIRWAY AND RIGHT FRONT OF GREEN WITH POSSIBILITY OF MOVING TEES UP AND DRIVING PAR 4 GREEN. #17 CAN REMEMBER WHEN GREEN WAS STRAIGHT AHEAD OVER POND, THEN MOVED BACK TO TOP OF HILL AS IN HIS 2005 VERSION---BUT SINCE HAS AGAIN BEEN MOVED DOWN TO RIGHT FRONT SIDE JUST OVER POND THAT HAVE SEEN BY WATCHING BMW EVENTS PLAYED RECENTLY THERE.
https://www.provisualizer.com/courses/m ... ourse3.php

https://www.presidentscup.com/future-events
2026 | MEDINAH COUNTRY CLUB, CHICAGO, ILLINOIS
Medinah is the fifth different venue in the United States to host the Presidents Cup and adds the biennial team event to an illustrious list of tournaments hosted at Course #3 that include the 2019 BMW Championship, 2012 Ryder Cup, two PGA Championships, three U.S. Opens, the 1988 U.S. Senior Open, three Western Opens (BMW Championship), and a number of other professional championships.

https://golfweek.usatoday.com/2023/05/2 ... p-medinah/
“I am thrilled to be named executive director of the 2026 Presidents Cup and look forward to returning to Chicago to guide what has become a staple of top global events in sports,” said Chitwood in a statement. “This city has a tremendous passion for golf as evidenced by the number of championships hosted through the years, and Medinah Country Club has played an incredible role in that history. We are going to engage the vibrant Chicagoland business community and its great sports fans to deliver an unforgettable week at the Presidents Cup.”

[aeerph]

Really awesome job on the course Eric!

As someone who played the course this summer, I think it was recreated really well. If I dial the wind up to 25 mph coming in from the west, it would be like when I was there. In real life, the course plays really fair, and if you stay on the fairway, you can post a pretty decent score as the greens are not excessively sloped or fast. I think it's primary defenses are it's length, the wind and the trees, as if you get more than a few yards off the fairway you have to keep your recovery shot below the canopy. My entire foursome was blown away at the experience of playing there. It's expensive, but the experience was really top notch.

As I have already mentioned, Eric did a fantastic job of making an accurate representation of the course. It was really enjoyable to play, and I found no problems. I didn't go looking to see if Eric included my cart partner's 5 wood near the water off to the left of the 10th fairway, after he chucked it over there after hooking a couple of shots in the water.

Andy

[GoBucks]

COULD THERE HAVE BEEN POSSIBLY A CHANGE IN PLANS? ALSO MEDINAH DONE
HERE IN LINKS BACK IN 2005 BY JOHN PINEDA HAS HAD A COUPLE OF HOLE CHANGES. #15 HAS HAD POND ADDED TO RIGHT SIDE OF FAIRWAY AND RIGHT FRONT OF GREEN WITH POSSIBILITY OF MOVING TEES UP AND DRIVING PAR 4 GREEN. #17 CAN REMEMBER WHEN GREEN WAS STRAIGHT AHEAD OVER POND, THEN MOVED BACK TO TOP OF HILL AS IN HIS 2005 VERSION---BUT SINCE HAS AGAIN BEEN MOVED DOWN TO RIGHT FRONT SIDE JUST OVER POND THAT HAVE SEEN BY WATCHING BMW EVENTS PLAYED RECENTLY THERE.

Why are you yelling at Jimbo?

[morvio100]

In places ..the trees look great...I admire the inventive method of sand spray around the bunkers...only played 2 holes...when I seen how bad the trees looked close up on the 2nd hole at tee off(very jarring)....its a dang pity...that theres no way of creating a high res tree(bark) texture....immersion killer....no disrepect meant...I know the game doesn't allow for a LOD texture for various distance (also very noticable on alot of courses ...when the ball lands beside a tree in the rough areas)....an old game limitation I guess

[ChuckH]

In places ..the trees look great...I admire the inventive method of sand spray around the bunkers...only played 2 holes...when I seen how bad the trees looked close up on the 2nd hole at tee off(very jarring)....its a dang pity...that theres no way of creating a high res tree(bark) texture....immersion killer....no disrepect meant...I know the game doesn't allow for a LOD texture for various distance (also very noticable on alot of courses ...when the ball lands beside a tree in the rough areas)....an old game limitation I guess

Are you sure you have the graphic slider all the way to the right? Maybe use a higher resolution.

[Danny D]

In places ..the trees look great...I admire the inventive method of sand spray around the bunkers...only played 2 holes...when I seen how bad the trees looked close up on the 2nd hole at tee off(very jarring)....its a dang pity...that theres no way of creating a high res tree(bark) texture....immersion killer....no disrepect meant...I know the game doesn't allow for a LOD texture for various distance (also very noticable on alot of courses ...when the ball lands beside a tree in the rough areas)....an old game limitation I guess

Here's the problem morv...

We get hi-rez photos of trees, let's say 10k x 10k as an example. We delete everything in background of the photo that is not part of the tree, and we make the background invisible. Now we have a big beautiful 10k x 10k tree that looks perfect.

Next we have to add it to the APCD and plant it on the course. Now, if ONLY it were possible to make the game of Links2003 actually accept that big beautiful tree, it would look perfect, even right up next to it.

But alas, the 20 year old game just can't deal with it. It's way too big.

So then we say, well what is the highest res that Links2003 can actually use?

1024x1024... So next we take that big beautiful 10k x 10k tree and make it about 10 times smaller. In doing so, all those damned little pixels start jamming up against each and breaking through one another, and causing blurred images of what used to be beautiful bark and leaves. Kinda looks like the woodchuck and beaver family had a party on it... Detailed clarity is near impossible at that resolution. Unless its a very small object.

Is a shame in a way. But imagine for a minute that Links would accept a 10k x 10k tree. Lets say you plant 100 different trees of that size. The CRZ would be so big it would have to be delivered by STEAM.

Best wishes,

Dan

[morvio100]

what about mip mapping....is there not some fancy dds compression that can be used on a 2 k/4 k image

[Big Sexy JC]

I think Dan did an exceptional job of explaining the limitations of an old game. Just to put things into perspective, there are 2441 courses in the library and roughly 50 of them are >180mb in size. That's 2%. The reason I used 180 is that I have anis that are 180mb in size. Just think about how impressive it is to put a plot of land with all the vegetation, bunkers, holes, 3D stuff, etc., etc. in less space than it takes to put a face, some skin, some hats, some pants, some shoes and some shirts. The comparison would be like putting a farm in your closet.

It's no wonder APCD crashes all the time. It's constantly trying to put 10lbs of potatoes into a 4lb bag. It doesn't matter what compression algorithm is used there is going to be degradation when you are reducing something by 90%. The good news is that it's almost 2024 and we all have more RAM, hard drive space and CPU power that can easily handle all of us designers pushing the game to it's limits. I thought long and hard about going to hi res anis and possibly slowing the framerates down and then laughed when I tested and literally couldn't tell any difference in the game play.

I'm amazed at how the course designers can make the courses look as good as they do with the constraints that the game puts on them. To that point, I always thought the elevation/contours of the links courses were lacking compared to real life. That is until linkster started providing LIDAR data to the designers. Holy crap the last dozen or so courses are SO much better when it comes to the changes in elevations being more accurate.

Great work by the designers and linkster for taking the course design to a new level. I wish I could contribute on that front, but I'm just the lowly ani, apparel and clubs guy.

[dorse72]

wait...hi-res anis? how good do they look? I'm always the last to know. I dont even have the add-on where you can view Links full-screen.

that was a great response, btw. My photos of those trees were taken with my Canon 1D4, back in 2012 prob the best 1 or 2 cameras available, pics were like 16mb each, all that resolution gets wasted when you shrink the tree down to 72dpi - 1024s, sad but what can you do ? Links just renders the trees like that when up close, nothing a designer can do, to call them out is sad really.

morvio100 wrote: ↑Mon Nov 06, 2023 11:39 pm
In places ..the trees look great...I admire the inventive method of sand spray around the bunkers...only played 2 holes...when I seen how bad the trees looked close up on the 2nd hole at tee off(very jarring)....its a dang pity...that theres no way of creating a high res tree(bark) texture....immersion killer....no disrepect meant...I know the game doesn't allow for a LOD texture for various distance (also very noticable on alot of courses ...when the ball lands beside a tree in the rough areas)....an old game limitation I guess

Maybe we call AJ maybe and ask him to get us more res? who knows, the answer is sadly to move on to a new designer, like these guys have - wow wow wow! unbelievable

https://harriskalinka.com/work/cabot-barrens/

[morvio100]

I agree completely Big Sexy JC....all good points...and yeah..what they done to this point is amazing...just look at the Bethpage 06 course...the level of texuring...is quite amazing....hope I didnt piss any designers off ...with my observation regards the blurriness of tree textures up close...no disrepect meant....is just a pity that no work around is possible ...guess the game would have had to be coded to allow for LOD textures back in the day....agree about the LIDAR scenario also....a new highly detailed topography level has bee achieved...which in itself is enough reason to continue playing..what is still many years later...probably the best golf game around...